油门踏板的 A 与 B 靠在一起了,你即使松开油门踏板,踏板也回不来了,因为 A 与 B 之间太紧密了,摩擦力太大了,超过了弹簧的张力。
那为何丰田车子会突然加速呢?按照物理学常识,油门踏板由于 A 与 B 过紧而不能弹回来,那油门也不会加大,虽然不会减小。其实,对这个问题我没看到解释。以润涛阎的猜测,也就是理论和逻辑推理,是因为开车的人发现油门没回来,卡住了,就想去踩一下,让它弹回来。可这一踩不要紧,油门踏板的 A 与 B 的接触面更大了,摩擦力也更大了,它就无法弹回来了不算,油门也加大了。这就是那位警察开Lexus 车子跑到120 迈的速度才撞毁的缘故。
您如果仔仔细细读完了上面润涛阎的解释,您就应该知道了:加上一块铁片,油门踏板的 A 与 B 就无法让油门开到最大了。因为油门开不到最大,真空管里的真空就能够让刹车不失灵。也就是说,丰田的这个补救办法不是说车子以后不会卡住油门了,而是卡住后,也不会刹不住车。即使驾驶员反复放开刹车,因为真空没问题,车子还会刹住的。
当然,丰田说以后不会卡住了。其实,道理在于:由于 A 与 B 的接触面积不能达到原来那么大了,摩擦力也就不会那么大了。但润涛阎以为:那块铁片不能太厚,因为太厚就无法加速了。也就是说,卡住的事还会发生的,只是即使发生,刹车系统不失灵,导致送命的情况就少了。车子能刹住,发动机发疯,那就让它疯一会好了。等你停下来,把发动机关掉,车子冷下来后,油门踏板一冷缩, A 与 B 之间就不那么紧了,弹簧就把它弹回来了。你再上路,继续享受开车的刺激。只要没有生命危险,有点刺激是人生的一种额外享受,要不怎么那么多人花钱去转那个6 flag 、迪尼斯之类的呢?
在所有的日本车中,只有Subaru 出的所有车种都是达标的G (好),其它的日本车有一个是本田的 Honda Element 达标外,全部不达标。只是因为美国高速公路管理局还没有把翻车能活下来作为指标,日本人就钻这个空子。尤其是丰田,连一辆达标的车都没有,丰田出了那么多种车,没有一种车是 G 。假如你开的不是Subaru ,而是其它日本车,那你就要小心了,千万别翻车,一旦翻车,你和乘客性命难保。
The CTS pedal has a friction arm that is designed to generate a certain degree of friction necessary for the proper functioning of the electronic gas pedal. In our earlier tear down and analysis, we pointed out that the CTS design is inferior to others, such as the Denso unit also used in Toyotas. The friction arm is subject to wear and contamination that increases friction to the point of creating a sticky gas pedal.
The friction arm is a pivoted fulcrum; the end with the “friction teeth” rides in two grooved channels in the pedal assembly. Both these parts are made from plastic. The other end of the friction arm is held in place by the return spring, which exerts the pressure necessary to generate the friction. As the friction teeth wear, the gap on the other end increases in relation to the housing. Toyota’s shim is inserted in this gap in order to reduce/limit the amount of friction, and to compensate for wear.
The gap is to be measured by a feeler gauge (photo above), which determines the thickness of shim that is then inserted in the gap. The shim then limits the travel of the fulctum on the spring end, thereby reducing the amount of friction on the teeth as they ride in the grooves.
The next step is to open the gap by inserting a narrow-shank screwdriver, so that the correctly-sized shim can be installed. The unit has been turned upside down to facilitate that.
The shim (gray steel) is now slid in, and positioned behind a lip that serves to retain it. The shim is kept in place by the pressure of the return spring on the fulcrum, but we wonder whether a strong jolt might not be able to dislodge it. If it did become dislodged, it could potentially cause serious problems. No one would ever design a unit like this with a loose metal shim that was held in place by spring pressure only.
The next picture shows the shim all the way in place behind the lip. It’s a good thing that lip exists, otherwise this fix would not be possible.
The photo above shows the inside of the unit, with the friction arm extending forward. The shim is clearly visible as the shiny gray rectangle. The pivot axles extending out on both sides of the fulcrum/friction arm are visible as two small white/gray pieces, just below and to both sides of the shim. The friction teeth are visible towards the front of the unit, riding (now higher) in their grooves.
This photo above was taken previously of the same pedal. It’s difficult to tell exactly from the slightly different angles whether the teeth are riding higher with the shim, but it does appear so. And a subjective impression was that the pedal had somewhat less friction. So the fix may well reduce the friction below a dangerous level, but for how long?
The only way we interpret the necessity of measuring the friction arm gap and choosing an appropriately sized shim is that the older units with more wear will have a smaller gap than the new(er) ones. The shim will compensate for that wear, but in a static, not dynamic way. As soon as the continued wear on the friction arm changes its size or other friction characteristics, the pedal is potentially back to the same sticky situation as before.
The shim’s effect on reducing the amount of friction will presumably slow down the wear process, but intrinsically, this is not a permanent fix to a very critical part, from a safety point of view. This is why the CTS-type pedal design is flawed, because it is subject to changes in the amount of friction it generates due to wear and other factors.
The only other explanation for the varying gap size and different shims is that the manufacturing tolerances are so great, that this is necessary to compensate for them. That’s that hard to imagine, for such a critical part. But if so, it raises other serious questions about this unit. Either way, it reinforces our position that Toyota needs to replace all the CTS pedals with Denso pedals or another proven pedal design, as soon as they are available. The shim fix is a Band Aid, and does not inspire the confidence that Toyota urgently needs to instill in its customers and the market place at this critical time.
Update: Given that Toyota has acknowledged that these pedal assemblies cost them $15, it would obviously be cheaper (and more reliable) to swap out the CTS units with the Denso unit rather than this fussier and riskier fix. The problem is time; it could take many months if not a year or more to change tooling and produce 2.3 million units. Meanwhile, making these shims was obviously something that a stamping manufacturer could do in days.
Toyota Motor Corp.’s China car sales beat General Motors Corp.’s in the first nine months of the year, as the Japanese company threatens to end GM’s 77-year reign as the world’s largest automaker.
Toyota’s two Chinese ventures boosted nine-month sales 30 percent to 407,427 cars and sport-utility vehicles. GM’s car sales were little changed at 373,945, according to Bloomberg calculations based on data issued by the China Association of Automobile Manufacturers.
至于解决方法那一段,老司机和新司机都应该知道减档用发动机制动的原理。但是在汽车油门卡住的紧急状态,在几秒钟甚至更短的时间内,没有几个人能及时想到并正确运用减档来减速。对于决大多数人,事先知道可行的紧急措施,才可能有效地应付紧急情况。所以值得这么大书特书!
ee19942010-02-22 16:04:31回复悄悄话回复cecil的评论:
Cecil,我相信您很专业,不过太过于全盘否定了,楼主本来就不在这里发表学术论文,细节错误是很可能的,文章并不是以技术语言写成的,技术细节不可能精确。至于"日本车的零件是两层皮的", it is just a figure of speech. I don’t take it literally. 我喜欢这篇文章的要点,楼主的风格就是夸张个人观点!This is a place for expressing yourself. One’s writing style may be exaggerated but entertaining, as long as the main ideas are based on facts. It does not have to be politically correct, or academically measured?
ee19942010-02-22 16:00:17回复悄悄话我有个问题请教楼主:how to find out whether a toyota car has CTS gas padel or Denso gas padel? We have a 2001 toyota camry and a 2006 toyota prius. They are not currently in recall list. But I want to find out more about our fmaily cars. 谢谢
cecil2010-02-22 05:07:10回复悄悄话楼主当日趾高气扬指丰田回收所有车後,所有丰田车极速都会降低,因为楼主话块块片妨碍最高的加油。
我都不想在这里重新贴回楼主指 “丰田回收修车後会令极速减低,而普通车主不觉”,这种不负责任和诽谤的言论。记录我是有的,楼主你更改就得吗?文章可以更改,但无知是改不了,这些全无技术的批评简直是小孩都不如,何况是出自个博士的文章???
本人就不是博士,不是 a range of car 的车主,不是经常发表 Blog, 这里出文都是因为楼主而注册。
原野青蛙2010-02-20 20:37:20回复悄悄话An article with detailed information, analysis, and data based not on hearsays or isolated examples, but on rich personal experience over a long period and covers a range of cars.
Those who have owned less than a handful of cars but are willing to comment have a good will, too, to prove from the other sides.
But they need to widen the perspective and learn how to debate, rather than merely drop a line or two saying it is not valid.
润涛阎2010-02-20 07:15:34回复悄悄话回复cecil的评论:
ccwu22010-02-18 16:58:44回复悄悄话A very intereting article. But I still do not understand the roles of “the vacuum” in car breaking process. Can anyone explain? Many thanks!
chaobang2010-02-18 12:05:18回复悄悄话如果看一下丰田为这个故障准备了多少种规格的小铁片,就应该能知道这个方案肯定是临时凑副的。首先,刹车里的那个摩擦片是必须的,要不然在设计的时候根本就不需要那个东东,直接去掉,肯定省时省力省工钱。其次,那个摩擦片的摩擦力是不能随便减少的,这也是丰田要准备那么多种铁片的原因,他们得根据实际的磨损情况去凑。如果因为接触面太小造成摩擦力不足,肯定有别的问题。然后,我觉得几处英文文章里有个问题,加了铁片后,摩擦力减少,但随着磨损的增加,那个铁片的厚度要减少而不是增加,也就是说,随着磨损的增加,摩擦片会更快的失效,而不是卡住。最后,个人觉得那个设计本身没有什么特别的问题,考虑到器件的磨损,要保证摩擦力不会随着消失,设计成那样是很有必要的。因此,问题的关键是摩擦材料的选择,CTS买了那个专利(似乎不是他们搞的,文件只是说他们买了),这个具体材料的选择好像不应该包含在那个专利里面,因此,问题仍然在丰田自己,CTS只是根据要求下料而已。至于有人说一眼就看出了所有人都看不出的问题,我觉得他肯定是看错了,所以才说得这么肯定。
顺便问个问题,不知道谁能帮忙解答一下,一个日本车厂的车处理问题,为什么那么多中国人比日本人还着急,甚至恨不得拉中国去给日本厂子垫背,这是怎么回事情呢?
有1说12010-02-18 10:34:53回复悄悄话好文也,
昔有润之,
今有润涛。
“So the fix may well reduce the friction below a dangerous level, but for how long?
The only way we interpret the necessity of measuring the friction arm gap and choosing an appropriately sized shim is that the older units with more wear will have a smaller gap than the new(er) ones. The shim will compensate for that wear, but in a static, not dynamic way. As soon as the continued wear on the friction arm changes its size or other friction characteristics, the pedal is potentially back to the same sticky situation as before.”
气门在大开的位置被卡死,“负压”消失,依赖负压才能工作的刹车系统的“真空助力器”不起作用。此状态下,刹车系统并没有失效,只是失去“助力”、被操作的灵敏度大大降低,所以,必须象lz建议的那样要拼命地去踩它。
solo12010-02-17 15:27:03回复悄悄话Why does Toyota need outside help? Insiders are often helpless with those events of very low probability.
A certain drug was suspected of suddenly causing deaths to patients in China. The top authority set a deadline to experts to solve the problem. All the tests showed the product was OK. Meanwhile, the police opened a separate criminal investigation, and detectives interviewed all the production staff. The police knew nothing about technology, but they did find out the only change was an insignificant procedure in another product.This clue from police helped the experts to identify the tiny amount of impurity.
By the way, Black Swan is a good book about the improbable.
solo12010-02-17 14:27:52回复悄悄话I never have had a car from Toyota, but a friend found out the unintended acceleration of Toyota Camry about two years ago during the first test drive at the dealer. He thought it was a system design problem and not a big deal, so he bought the car. His advice: Just do not press the gas pedal too harsh. He is quite experienced, from the days of repairing tractors and combines at Beidafan.
bbbbtttt2010-02-17 14:06:13回复悄悄话另外,CTS的踏板是CTS自己的专利,哪个录像链接里有解释,不大象是丰田设计的。
bbbbtttt2010-02-17 14:02:48回复悄悄话老阎,给你两个链接:
thanks for your comments. however,”the explanation with different thermal expansion for brake failure” is not what i thought. i said that “the explanation with different thermal expansion … for gas pedal…”.
i believe that the vaccum is the cause for the brake failure.
Best regards!
solo12010-02-17 11:57:21回复悄悄话The author certainly has real knowledge and hands-on experience with cars. But the explanation with different thermal expansion for brake failure seems not valid. Toyota does not give a convincing explanation either.
The rare and non-reproducible problem is very difficult for inside experts. The president of Toyota admitted this and asked for outside help. Unfortunately he turned to the wrong people, or quality control people, for help. Quality control is the strength of Japanese cars. Mr. Toyoda should ask someone like the author for help.
全方位2010-02-17 11:45:19回复悄悄话不明白技术原理什么的,不过耳闻目睹了几起日车和美车相撞事件,都是日本车吃亏,有的美国车都没什么事,日本车给撞得不成样子
bowne2010-02-17 11:09:23回复悄悄话个人觉得不能换1挡或2挡. 以前为了省油, 经常不踩刹车而用换挡来减速. 正常情况下是可以的: 先缩一下油门, 再换挡辅助减速. 但是如果高速突然换低挡, 很容易损坏变速箱, 不信可以试一下, 变速箱的巨大的杂音让人心惊肉跳.
另外, 你说的”真空”是压力储存罐吧? 我觉得助理方向盘高速时压力为零可以理解, 助理刹车为零就不可理解了, 除非他们共用一个液压泵
xiaoguaidan2010-02-17 10:25:07回复悄悄话I have a question about Toyota cars.
I bought a 2009 Toyota Corolla LE. Since the VIN of this car starts with “J”, I did not receive any letter for recall.
Can you tell me the difference of car manufactured in Japan and in other country?
I have driven this car for 10 months. It is still pretty good and smooth. Do you suggest I should sell this car?
Thanks a lot
润涛阎2010-02-17 10:25:03回复悄悄话回复tmsk面朝大海的评论:
power brake and power steering 都是液压,但都需要真空。不需要真空的2008年以后的corolla今天新闻说可能召回,因为方向盘失控。
bbbbtttt2010-02-17 09:28:01回复悄悄话楼主从哪里听说的“真空助力转向”,给个链接?历史上有液压助力转向、电动助力转向、速度调节助力转向等等,俺还是第一次听说有“真空助力转向”。况且,楼主所说的真空调节根本行不通,你所说的是要解决“高速时转向过于灵敏”,这里指的是车速,而不是发动机转速,两者完全不是一回事。比如下大坡时,发动机转速很低,车速却很高,这时助力应该减小而不是增大。现在大部分的车仍然采用液压助力转向,动力来源是连在发动机上的液压泵。
wogenwole2010-02-17 09:23:08回复悄悄话每次能从各位网友的回复中学到不少知识,我想大家都不是小孩,应该有自己的主见。感谢所有回帖的人!
润涛阎2010-02-17 09:17:34回复悄悄话回复天涯过客-的评论:
秀才呵:是那些遇到故障的车主有幻觉?或是车厂有幻觉?还是另外有人有幻觉?
zhangyonguc2010-02-17 08:58:55回复悄悄话楼主精神可嘉,但是,并不完全正确,个人认可度低于50%
jw787322010-02-17 08:57:30回复悄悄话阎先生 is misleading the readers: Shifting to 1st or 2nd gear while the engine is running at high RPM is not going to slow down the car. First, with automatic transmission, shifting to 1st or 2nd gear doesn’t mean you will get 1st or 2nd gear immediately. The onboard computer will look at the car speed and shift from 5th to 4th, 3rd and 2nd and 1st gear depending on the car speed. This is to prevent damage to the transmission. Second, when engine speed can be as high as 6K to 7K RPM when gas padel is stuck, you car can still be accelerating (If you drove a manual shift before, you know this).
Follow NHTSA’s recommendation and shift to “Neutral” when the gas pade is stuck!
FKJP2010-02-17 08:48:38回复悄悄话反驳的人没有几个能从专业的角度去阐述问题。很多人回复不过是片面之辞,没有说服力,看到美国车都是trash我笑了,看到Ford也在其中我哈哈大笑,日本车都是神车吗?那丰田的事情怎么说?悲剧没有发生在你身上你就可以睁眼说瞎话?可悲的国人。
jw787322010-02-17 08:00:07回复悄悄话I have a 206 Camry. I have the same problem. The brake is very weak. Honda and Nissan have much better brakes. Also
changing to softer brake pads helps. The 350Z’s brake is very very good although the pads don’t last long.
回复jgbg的评论:本人2002年买的丰田,由于刹车问题,前后撞了4次,第4次车头撞了变形并报废(气垫也没有弹出)。所辛人没有受伤。太太老是抱怨车子刹不住。不过,她还是顽固不化,坚持买日本的车子。我开了10美国车子,从来没有发生刹车问题,质量问题也少。家有两种车子,时间一长,质量问题就会显现出来。
jw787322010-02-17 07:54:46回复悄悄话回复润涛阎的评论:
1) is incorrect. If brake parts (rotors and pads) become too hot, brake will not function normally and that’s called “Fade”. That’s why you should not put your foot on brake when going down hill for a long time. I personally experienced brake “fake” with Nissan 350Z for several times. Read “Car and Driver” and you will find that this is a common issue with sports cars.
蔡真妮2010-02-17 07:34:42回复悄悄话老阎真是专家啊!虽然我看不懂文中机械构造的东西,但是对于遇到紧急情况下的应对措施以及提前演练的建议是受益匪浅。
我也是收到了朋友群发的邮件才找到这里。
谢谢老阎,码这么多字没有几个小时是下不来的,这份助人的心思更是难得。
祝老阎及全家新春快乐!万事如意!
真妮合十
行着2010-02-17 07:26:20回复悄悄话我不喜欢日本车。虽然第一辆也是honda,当时不太懂,价格和外观主导了我的决定。之后周围几个懂车的朋友一再说日本车的不好,等买了第2辆opel对比以后才真正体会到二者的差异。两辆车都没出过什么大毛病,各有各的小毛病。honda表面做工更细致,功能更体贴一些,opel更粗糙,内部设计很不人性化。虽然从来没出过什么事故,但明显感觉opel更扎实,开了这车再去开那辆同级别的honda感觉有点像在开个纸箱,上高速都不敢使劲踩了(这辆honda是日本原厂,不知道跟大家的是否有很大差别)。另外亲眼见过同型号的honda一次车祸,2、30的速度刹不住追尾(路面湿滑),感觉就是轻轻一碰,结果honda前脸大变形,发动机熄火冒浓烟,发动机盖弹起,气囊没出,前面的车就保险杆稍微变形(四驱,忘了什么车)。也短期开过几种toyota,感觉还不如honda。以后是坚决不会再买日本车了。
谢谢大家!
52682010-02-17 02:46:44回复悄悄话好文收藏了。刹车失灵,挂最低挡还是正确的。空档没用。
西客2010-02-17 02:28:16回复悄悄话估计丰田有人看了楼主的文章,终于考虑安装‘刹车是爷系统’了。
Japanese carmaker Toyota will add a brake-override system to all new vehicles as it seeks to recover from a global car recall.
丰田有大问题,需要改进,但说日本车不如美国车,就不敢苟同了。最后,选什么车是个人的选择。日本车占美国市场40%,中国人只占其中很小的一部分。要说什么车安全,可查阅美国联邦NHTSA的网站。同等大小的车,日本车平均售价比美国车贵不少,决不是靠牺牲安全性换来的。
晓安2010-02-16 20:47:59回复悄悄话About roof strength: I just checked IIHS test results, and Japanese cars are some of the best. For example, in Midsize moderately priced cars catogery, Toyota Camry is rated good, having the BEST strength-to-weight ratio of 5.31. Compared to Ford Fusion’s 3.33, and even the Volvo S40 has only 3.92 (both rated acceptable). See http://www.iihs.org/ratings/roof/detailsbyclass.aspx?30
Conclusion: either the author purposefully misleads readers, or he does not know what he is talking about.
SehrGut2010-02-16 20:30:02回复悄悄话我靠!
你们这么多人指责楼主政治错误也就罢了。你们能不能说说这种问题是怎么产生的以及出现这种问题怎么解决呢?
既然丰田是这么好的一辆车,总不能我刹不住车而且油门降不下来的时候,我就那么快乐地享受丰田的优质质量吧?
SehrGut2010-02-16 20:27:55回复悄悄话回复人中人的评论:
那么能否详细地讲讲这次丰田刹不住车具体究竟是什么原因以及这种情况下怎么处理?
另外,你是暗示这个造成的原因是美国CTS的零件供应不合格么?
吴敬中2010-02-16 20:23:40回复悄悄话不是不要脸就能当流氓,也不是只要反日就是爱国。
有点技术含量吧
mydream2010-02-16 20:19:06回复悄悄话说美国车坚固是笑话, 还记得前些年福特Explorer/Firestone轮胎暴胎翻车死人吧? 就是福特Explorer的车顶不结实. 还有前几年的汽车事故死亡率, 最高的一直是GM的Chevy Blazer.
Laoru2010-02-16 20:08:43回复悄悄话出入良心, 想再补充一点:
Maybe the driver accidentally dropped a piece of magnetic stone or something, that caused a a confusion.
Boy, taking a closer look at this pedal, i am so scared, it “IS CONNECTED TO THIN ELECTRONIC WIRES!!!!!”, I always imagined there is a metal lever connect to the throttle! Does anyone know if a BMW X5 (2006 model) is also connected through a wire?
红泥小火炉2010-02-16 18:48:11回复悄悄话谢谢文章和评论。
熄火后方向机没有助力,不是没有方向。况且时速越高方向越轻。没有多少人可以保证在你说的那种情况下能控制自己只死死踩住一脚刹车,我讲的是在实际操作及事故是否发生的判断中。 熄火保命机会比较好把握一些。
有希望2010-02-16 17:09:36回复悄悄话文章和评论都不错,长了不少见识.感谢大家
SehrGut2010-02-16 17:09:33回复悄悄话回复人中人的评论:
光看你在这里夸日本车,能不能讲讲这个刹车失灵,不能降速到底是怎么回事呢?总不能是因为车太好了造成的吧?
如果是因为车太好的原因,那也请解释一下,到时候我们也好知道怎么处理。
难人2010-02-16 17:08:11回复悄悄话回复世界边缘人的评论:
刚才说的是丰田车油门故障,刹车失灵,生死极速的时候如何让车停下来保命。
Sehrgut2010-02-16 17:06:10回复悄悄话回复ASUN的评论:
那美国这几起刹车失灵突然加速的事故又怎么解释呢?
人中人2010-02-16 17:02:53回复悄悄话结论:不要用自己买的需要修理且难治愈的旧车质量来衡量汽车,等你有了经济和阅历的积累,开过3-5个不同品牌,不同档次的车之后再评论汽车也不晚。中国有句“一叶障目”,而阎先生似乎不光眼睛给遮住了,连正常思维也lost。这样不好!
人中人2010-02-16 16:55:49回复悄悄话关于日本车的安全性也是一个不争的事实:日本车全部都接受世界最高级别的全部安全测试,近几年经常被评为年度世界安全性第一。(SUBARU就是例子)日本车钢板薄,塑料件多是事实,但日本车的车体构造和材料在同档次车中不比任何品牌差。世界的消费者不会傻到冒着生命危险去买日本车,也不会弱智到让“垃圾的”日本车如此地风靡世界市场。一位日本老板朋友开奔驰,但他苦恼地对我说:开奔驰是为了自己作为老板的面子,而奔驰的经常性故障令他苦恼,他最愿意开的是自己以前的丰田皇冠。总之,日本车不是法拉利,不是保时捷,而是一种适合大多数人使用的交通工具,而且在世界汽车行业中,日本车的性价比 故障少 节能 驾驶性都是Best。
世界边缘人2010-02-16 16:41:29回复悄悄话回复难人的评论:关闭发动机,刹车和方向也同时没有了
auser2010-02-16 16:39:30回复悄悄话我怎么查不到2010年Nissan的车是带有Brake Override System的。能否给个此信息的连接?
世界大舞台2010-02-16 16:39:05回复悄悄话有道理。Several comments:
1。日本车做工精细但不经撞,美国车经撞但做工粗糙,这个 开车的人都知道。之
所以人们多买日本车,恐怕更多的还是出于耐用性的考虑。买车也是权衡各种利弊
的一个过程。今后人们在选车时可能会把安全性的权重加高而选择欧美车,毕竟生
命的意义远高于其他一切。日本车肯定会失去一部分market share, American car
may get some。但恐怕欧洲车会 gain the most if think about the quality and
reliability。
2。没看懂为什么油门全打开后刹车的真空会lost。感觉给油和刹车是两个不同的系
统。难道它们是coupled的吗?如果是coupled的,那很可能电控和软件may play bigger
roles in the failure。懂行的给解释一下?
3。跟换档一样,switch off “Over drive” 也可以改变齿轮的传速比达到减速的目
的。
7.最后,祝大家好运!新年快乐!
tmsk面朝大海2010-02-16 16:18:18回复悄悄话日本车不是给中国人捧红的,美国能有多少中国人?当然你要说大多数人都是穷人,美国穷人,那也算对了,买辆车要考虑质量,维修什么的,肯定不是太有钱的人。
难人2010-02-16 16:17:30回复悄悄话回复难人的评论:
有一点说错了,不能拔钥匙,会所死方向盘的。抱歉!
jw787322010-02-16 16:11:51回复悄悄话Some of the author’s opinions make sense. Other’s not:
1) Camry has weak brakes. This is true. But Honda and Nissan have good brakes. I own a Camry, a Odessey and a Nissan 350Z. The camry brake is really really weak and my wife almost tailgated the car in front the first time she drove it. Toyota really did a poor job on the brake.
2) Poor American drives Japanese cars. This is not true. A lot of my co-workers, some of them are rich and none of them are poor, drive Japanese cars. They buy Japanese cars because American cars have developed very poor reputation in the last 20 years.
3) Used Toyotas are priced cheap. This is no longer true in last 10 years. Toyotas resale value is much higher than American cars now (before the recalls).
jsljb2010-02-16 16:10:21回复悄悄话德车,美车就不出事故吗?作者从地道里出来吧,别挖了。买什么车是个人的事,由不得你,有人就是喜欢日车,你能怎么办?
难人2010-02-16 16:07:14回复悄悄话不一定要把出来,后退两档(与点火想反)就可以了。
事故警察开的Lexus如果是新款的点火方式(非钥匙),没试过可不可以!
哪得不留连2010-02-16 15:55:55回复悄悄话回复难人的评论:
关掉发动机减速,是不是把车匙拔出来?
难人2010-02-16 15:52:39回复悄悄话回复无色无相的评论:
有点离题了!XX佬贬义词,歧视意勿用为好!如果你不愿意被人称你“XX”佬,此事也一样。
爱国本身就是狭义和盲目的,无可厚非。
如果有华车进入美国,到那时也会有人开!不信,拭目。
哪得不留连2010-02-16 15:52:13回复悄悄话回复难人的评论:
关掉发动机减速,是不是把车匙拔出来?
azkaban2010-02-16 15:34:42回复悄悄话回复zxcvbnmasdfg的评论:
你反正要追尾的,撞东西的,那还是捡15年以上的美国车买吧,不心疼。
azkaban2010-02-16 15:31:05回复悄悄话回复难人的评论:
没有转向,除非路是笔直的,你不定撞什么了。你力气比较大,不需要助力转向,不代表别人都不需要。挂空挡,减速效果和你关发动机一样,还多了转向助力,也适合大多数人。
无色无相2010-02-16 15:28:03回复悄悄话看了本文前半段, 已经无语了
汽车是用来“跑”的, 不是用来“学习”的, 跑过之后, 你就知道“富人”开的美国车是多么的垃圾了。
美国车销量能挺过这几十年, 还是拜托一群乡村型傻乎乎的美国佬比较盲目的爱国和孤陋寡闻
jnr2010-02-16 15:25:47回复悄悄话wow, very informative blog. American and European auto manufacturers need to cut a big check for your promo for their products…ha..
now i have a second thought about Japanese cars…. thought they are the best quality ones even though I’ve driven German and American cars….
无色无相2010-02-16 15:22:00回复悄悄话美国车之垃圾没有开过五种以上不能体会,
我常去BUSINESS TRIP,十个小时以下车程都自己租车开,以前的租车公司都是用美国经济型车, 而且里数都很低,
不是很同意”两层皮”是问题根源的观点. 在1990-2005年间, 日本车厂出产了最为可靠的大众交通工具, 受到过日子精打细算的中国人的追捧是必然的. 很少人会深究开哪个牌子的车会被白人看作有钱人, 每天早上送小孩不要迟到才是最要紧的. 我刚刚卖了我的95年TOYOTA CAMRY, 15年间除了换易损件没有进过修车店. TOYOTA的问题是近几年总体质量下降, CAMRY在CONSUMER REPORT 上的质量评分已降到了3分(平均), 而福特的同类车的质量评分上升到了5分. 我这次换车就买了FORD FUSION HYBRID来替换CAMRY. 不管是哪国的车, 质量上乘才是首选. 在犹太把持的CONSUMER REPORT上, 质量分低于3分的, 再好的车也不被推荐. 中国人和犹太人的价值取向还是很接近的.
ASUN2010-02-16 15:12:49回复悄悄话看见冒充内行的闫哥侃车,我就好笑。
闫哥的很多文章,我是佩服得骂娘的。但这一次,请闫哥先去学习一下电控发动机的基本原理再来侃不迟。
总体说来,所有作动(ACTION)都是由主控电脑(PCM)发出指令来操作的,指令的依据来自各个传感器(节气门开度信号,车速信号,刹车信号,爆震信号,,,甚至包括大气压力信号),我们所做的事只是给出这个信号。比方,你要加速,就踩下“油门”,其实这个油门跟油没有直接关系,而是拉开了节气门(进多少空气),节气门开度信号(TPS)传给PCM,PCM根据其他工况信号,根据理想空燃比的原则,再给喷油嘴一个脉频宽度--就是喷油时间吧。喷油嘴就是一个螺线管,高中生都知道,通电,柱塞就被拉开,断电弹簧就把它拉回去了。刹车加速,更是见鬼,你只要一点刹车,PCM就把油给断了,何来动力加速?除非:1,下坡,肉眼看不见的下坡;2,幻觉,超长途驾驶,幻觉是最主要杀手。
难人2010-02-16 15:10:25回复悄悄话回复azkaban的评论:
如果车开到120麦你还需要转向吗?
再说,有车速的时候没有助力是可以开车的!!
难人2010-02-16 15:07:21回复悄悄话回复felixcat的评论:
不支持对作者的攻击。还是谈技术吧。
谢谢
二哥2010-02-16 15:06:44回复悄悄话If I found the car stops reacting I will try putting it to N (neutral) first, if that fails I will turn off the engine. And I will step on the brake with all forces, and perhaps apply the handbrake as well. It will take the Lexus 30 seconds to go to 120 mph. Obviously the police guy is not thinking – he had time to talk to 911 but his should focus on thinking…
azkaban2010-02-16 15:04:15回复悄悄话啊,那个使劲踩刹车的招真绝啊。
我相信,在高速上,你使劲踩刹车,刹车盘和闸片很快就会变红,变软,和没有了差不多。这样最后牺牲的同志们一定要去找博主索命啊。不是那么傻的人还是挂空档吧,关发动机是不成的,没有转向助力了。
felixcat2010-02-16 14:56:49回复悄悄话这位润涛阎说“在所有的日本车中,只有Subaru 出的所有车种都是达标的G (好),其它的日本车有一个是本田的 Honda Element 达标外,全部不达标”,这里纯粹就是在胡说了。
数据不说谎。对车顶施加压力,看峰值压力到哪个值的时候车顶开始变形,IIHS测试结果(单位:lb):
Chevrolet Aveo:7935; Mini Cooper: 8810;Toyota Yaris: 9072; Hyundai Accent:9526。
凡事都说“材料不行”这种大而空的套话的,一般就属于“半桶水”的这种层次。
世界大舞台2010-02-16 14:50:59回复悄悄话回复无名男英雄的评论:
Not really. Nissan’s brake is very efficient.
gaoannie2010-02-16 14:42:11回复悄悄话I learn a lot from you with many thakns!!
I have Toyota RAV4.
北京小丫头2010-02-16 14:41:24回复悄悄话开卷有益,受益匪浅。
fitwxc2010-02-16 14:33:32回复悄悄话好文,好文,好文!!!
另外很反感这种把别人都当作洗脑的语言,你有焉知自己不是被洗脑。凡是都反对与凡是都支持一样,也是一种无主见的典型。
dadaoda2010-02-16 14:17:14回复悄悄话谢谢阎”八路”.
无名男英雄2010-02-16 14:13:02回复悄悄话日本车刹车迟缓确实很严重.
tmsk面朝大海2010-02-16 14:00:42回复悄悄话这种观点曾经在国内的汽车论坛上很流行啊,呵呵。
就说一点吧,不知道那些车算是给穷人开的,很多家给10万迈的保修就是为了和丰田竞争,哪怕打落牙齿往肚子里咽,和价格战是一个道理,还有高级车还搞送终身机油这样的小花招呢,而丰田,本田就是不跟进,牛吧?
现在嘛,老大开始收拾它们了。不过取代他们地位的一定是韩国车,不会是美国车。
felixcat2010-02-16 13:54:09回复悄悄话CTS踏板那个图的A和B的作用根本就不是像LZ说的“测出的是 A 与 B 之间的接触面积(踩油门越大,接触面积越大),也就是测出的是‘电流’然后送给电脑”,踏板里真正的传感器是另外几个元件,润涛阎自己没找到而已。
另外把一个零件用两种材料分成两部分组合在一起,反而成了省成本了?可以一次性铸造而成的部件,现在反而要做两个模子,然后分别铸成两部分,还要加一道工序粘合在一起——不用专业知识,常人都知道这样成本反而会高很多。
KDSZ2010-02-16 13:52:35回复悄悄话我开的04toyota sienna总觉得刹车时不是立即停下,尤其是下雨时我不敢开太。它的刹车系统好像一两年前才换过什么零件。而我另一辆车BMW刹车就好太多了,怎么冲都刹的稳稳的,非常好开。
bagua2010-02-16 13:49:23回复悄悄话润涛,我太佩服你了!
solo12010-02-16 13:44:51回复悄悄话The thermal expansion coefficients of carbon steel with different strength would be roughly the same. But there may be considerable differences if special alloys are used.
AnitaM2010-02-16 13:43:10回复悄悄话谢谢!俺也开始担心了,俺家是斯巴鲁四驱。今年雪大, 还庆幸来着。
KDSZ2010-02-16 13:42:32回复悄悄话多谢。让我们对日本车有了真正的认识。我一直觉得camry好开,质量也不错。真没想到丰田一下子出这么大的事。还是动脑筋的专家内行啊。
鲁道夫2010-02-16 13:42:04回复悄悄话好文,顶。
你文中:中国人习惯“同向思维”说,非常同意。我以前从国内到国外一直开日车,习惯了日车的操控性,省油(可能是轻的缘故),内饰精致,倒也觉着还成。直到上个月修车时租了一辆新款IMPALA开,才豁然明白,比起我原先的日车安静,路噪小的多,沉稳、舒适,一座进去就觉着非常有安全感。等我原先的车修好后再一开起来都不适应了,真就跟开一玩具似的,以前别人说我也不信,主要是这么多年日车开过来,思维都习惯了,这期间没怎么摸过美车,没有比较。别人说美车怎么怎么好,打死也不相信。建议没开美车的同志先不急买,租一辆新款开上两天,保证会有新的感受。
Embassy2010-02-16 13:39:38回复悄悄话日本车保养得好能开30万 英里,没问题.
美国车10万英里就扛不住了.
当初大家都这么说的.
Embassy2010-02-16 13:36:27回复悄悄话放空档踩刹车,能不能刹住车呢?
魯道2010-02-16 13:34:01回复悄悄话明白了,謝謝啊
LEOTHECAT2010-02-16 13:26:07回复悄悄话回复方枪枪的评论:
Isuzu 是GM的另外一个牌子。Good luck!!!
ccwu22010-02-16 13:25:28回复悄悄话Could you please explain more indetail on your statement: “而刹车用的 power brake (动力刹车系统),需要真空”? I though the “power break” machnism was “pressure” from an oil-cylinder, instead of “vacuum”. Thanks!
va_landlord2010-02-16 13:25:19回复悄悄话有事实,有根据! 好文章!
leothecat2010-02-16 13:23:54回复悄悄话我在93年买了辆全新的Subaru Impreza, 取车时看起来很完美,到晚上开车 才发现parking lights 一盏都不着。回dealer检查,发现parking lights 的保险丝没有安装。dealer说每辆车有上万个零件,少一两个是很正常的。
总的来说,日车少毛病,美车是垃圾。现在美国政府也选用日车。
方枪枪2010-02-16 13:23:12回复悄悄话Isuzu的车您有经验么?质量怎么样?我开2002 Rodeo Sport
前后左右2010-02-16 13:20:54回复悄悄话提个意见。你说的两层皮不确切。工程材料上高硬度与高韧性往往是对立的。但很多时候工程上需要表面硬,整体韧的材料以提高零件的使用寿命。所以“两层皮”不单是经济考量。内外如一的整体材料往往不能满足这样的要求,要么是提前磨损,要么是提前断裂。前苏与美国是资源大国。往往在工程上不计成本采用实打实的单一材料。但使用效果并不好。前苏、美国车的使用寿命不如日车就是明证。
七十年代国产某铁路机车零件使用寿命是日德产的十分之一以下。买来日德的类似产品发现是很次材料制的“两层皮”。技术人员骂过娘后,不由佩服人家的思考。。。
话说回来,这次丰田是玩过了。
关键字2010-02-16 13:10:14回复悄悄话润涛阎最牛B!多谢这么多字码字,受益匪浅啊。
我的地址: zheng88usa@yahoo.com.
Thanks for your attention.
felicia_f2010-02-16 13:04:33回复悄悄话好文章谢谢啦
starwars2010-02-16 13:01:25回复悄悄话牛人.阎大哥在那里修车?
东方邪2010-02-16 12:54:55回复悄悄话阎大侠全才啊,长见识了。
marxu2010-02-16 12:53:33回复悄悄话高!实在是高!
留意2010-02-16 12:51:39回复悄悄话尼桑是不是更差劲啊?我家有一辆VAN,不知道刹车是不是也有问题。
yyang32010-02-16 12:45:53回复悄悄话回复planojw的评论:
1. Is 日本车 the only one that has recall?
others recall voluntarily, toyota is the only one not so voluntarily.
2. Is this the first recall ever happen to 日本车?
same as 1.
3. Why this recall has such high publicity?
think it this way, if you hold all the recalls from past 10 years into one day, did you think it will get high publicity? I would say it not high enough yet.
4. There are 19 death caused by car issue. What’s the default % from all the people who owns 日本车?
are you saying when SUA happens, only certain % of your body will die?
5. How many people had accident due to reasons are not car defacts?
what’s the difference? the accident caused by car defect are not accident?
6. Does every part necessary to be built by steel? If so, you probably need to drive a tank rather than car.
so you are driving a car made of plastic, uh, in another word, a toy car?
7. Some non-Jap car makers products will require frequent visit to dealership, even the warranty is free. Is that high quality?
jap quality is not high quality, when I was in china, I did repair a lot electronics, and I learned what beauty on surface means by open those jap electronics. after came here I start repair cars, and I learned it again by open those jap cars.
I personally think this recall hype is 08’s way of promoting US cars.
obviously you came here not long. if u know that happened to Audi during 80s and Mitsubishi during 90s, you will understand what happened now.
syyu2010-02-16 12:42:42回复悄悄话牛逼中的牛逼!
vwbeetle2010-02-16 12:36:58回复悄悄话很多人认为: 这是一件商业竞争 设计出来的 陷害之计.
恐怖啊! “商”人竞争,什么坏事都会做!
大家不要想的太单纯!!!
muger2010-02-16 12:35:35回复悄悄话好文! 但我还有一个问题: 为什么有些丰田的车型不在回招之列, 比如说Sienna, 4Runner? 难道这些车不是用的”两层皮”踏板吗?
laoyueyue2010-02-16 12:34:41回复悄悄话给你敬了礼吧, 我的车是本田2002 ACCORD, 但愿别有事。
清凉之夏2010-02-16 12:30:09回复悄悄话顶好文,学到很多.多谢.
6grizzly2010-02-16 12:23:37回复悄悄话Wow! I didn’t expect to be NIU BI someday when I bought Ford Festiva in 2000, Chev Malibu in 2003, and Audi A4 in 2006.
LOLCAT2010-02-16 12:23:02回复悄悄话我家有辆好像是1993年出厂的日产(Nissan),到现在还照样天天跑,一点问题没有。。。
chinasmart2010-02-16 12:19:05回复悄悄话刹不住车,挂一档还是很有用的。我雪天冰上溜车,就是靠一档减速的!
jennytomato2010-02-16 12:16:00回复悄悄话阎大哥:
我的车只有P R N D 四个档。您是指拉回到那个档啊?Parking档吗?
(我的车是宝马X3)
多谢。
palmdodo2010-02-16 12:14:44回复悄悄话谢谢老阎的详尽解释,不看不知道,一看吓一跳。
我是在开日本车,以前被美国车搞怕了,大众听说小毛病更多。最后弄了个Subaru Impreza说实话我觉得操控没话说,就是车身还是单薄。可是这个没有”刹车师爷”系统,这个咋办?推空档,拉手刹?
planojw2010-02-16 12:12:18回复悄悄话日本车 recall more of political reasons
Before we conclude that 日本车 are all poorly built, let’s ask ourselves following questions:
1. Is 日本车 the only one that has recall?
2. Is this the first recall ever happen to 日本车?
3. Why this recall has such high publicity?
4. There are 19 death caused by car issue. What’s the default % from all the people who owns 日本车?
5. How many people had accident due to reasons are not car defacts?
6. Does every part necessary to be built by steel? If so, you probably need to drive a tank rather than car.
7. Some non-Jap car makers products will require frequent visit to dealership, even the warranty is free. Is that high quality?
I personally think this recall hype is 08’s way of promoting US cars.
jewishgirl2010-02-16 12:11:57回复悄悄话How about 99VW passat?
Does it have brake assitant? Is that good?
We are lucky. We just sold our Camry last summer and we have two VW now.
purenaturalhoney2010-02-16 12:07:24回复悄悄话大长了学问,谢谢。不过我开的是2008年的Prius, 只有R,N, D, B 这几裆,假如油门失灵的话,我应该放到哪一档上呢?
不胜感激。
lizecn732010-02-16 12:06:46回复悄悄话好文章, 文理全才. 怪不得我老婆喜欢德国车. 可惜我水平有限, 不然可以把这篇文章翻译给她看.她总在纳闷那警察怎么不挂空挡. 老实说, 那真空和煞车的关系我看完了这篇文章也还半懂不懂, 不知如何给她解释. 不管怎样, 确实是好文章, 谢了.
残阳如血2010-02-16 12:04:54回复悄悄话润涛阎 您的文章看了不少了, 这一篇让人刮目相看. 没想到老兄还有这么一手. 我是穷人中的穷人, 我的车是 KIA Sorento SUV. 您对它有什么意见? (我开了5年, 没发现啥子毛病, 就是敌勒越来越少, 做Service 不太方便了)
troycity2010-02-16 12:01:10回复悄悄话这种文章以前都没看到过,现在都出来了,真巧。
troycity2010-02-16 12:01:08回复悄悄话这种文章以前都没看到过,现在都出来了,真巧。
runelf2010-02-16 11:56:57回复悄悄话开subaru的飘过。。。。。
wc3332010-02-16 11:56:03回复悄悄话If you see these picture, you will believe this article is absolutely right.
大家不要想的太单纯!!!
Was19992010-02-16 11:48:37回复悄悄话Pal, you are the best! I’m driving a Ford Escape. Small but powerful enough.
冬心2010-02-16 11:48:06回复悄悄话谢谢你的文章,真的学到了不少东西。
不过,美国车的毛病不断,也的确是事实,我在美国开了至少30年车,家里总共买过10来辆车,除了第一辆是2万哩的二手野马,其他全是买新的。福特,通用还有富豪都买过,不过都是一两万就开始毛病不断,一辆福特还为了路上不断死火连续到车行修了六次才修好,然后就是冷气,变速箱,气缸漏油,风扇不转什么的。反而是几辆丰田,10年了从来没有过大毛病,除了换刹车和轮胎,电池,还真的没有进车行修过。(补充一下,第一辆丰田的确是水泵盖漏水,其他几辆就没有这个毛病)。
说到安全方面,只要看看记录,相信美国车也不怎么光彩,看来只好开坦克比较安全。
路过,所以飘过2010-02-16 11:48:05回复悄悄话我的是ACCORD2005,因为没长期驾驶其它牌子的车,不好比较,但是对于这个ACCORD,我是有点怕了,一次在高速上突然失去动力,油门和刹车都踩不懂,最让我后怕的是方向牌已经锁死,而万幸的是那天星期天,路上车很少,而且发生在在退出高速的过程中。还来送去DEALER那里修,只是说蓄电池FAIL,靠,如果电池经常这种FAIL方式,不出大事故才叫怪的。
天意不可违2010-02-16 11:47:00回复悄悄话没看懂真空管是怎么工作的,为什么最大油门就没真空了,而踩住刹车真空就又回来了。
wyx20002010-02-16 11:46:40回复悄悄话就事论事,日本不行,德国就好?韩国就好?在国人论坛里(我爱我家)之类的,看到最多的是小心中国货。等中国货质量上去了,不用呼吁大家都会转用国货了。
whiterainh2010-02-16 11:44:10回复悄悄话Nice! thanks!
yyang32010-02-16 11:43:27回复悄悄话totally agree, especially the 两层皮, another example, the nuts and bolts used on jap car are soooooooooo soft, it is impossible to not break a bolt when working on a old jap car.
mngb2010-02-16 11:40:32回复悄悄话在问楼主,我喜欢GMC的acadia,这车如何
超级麦考鱼2010-02-16 11:33:17回复悄悄话回复明月天山的评论:
在我身边听到,看到太多的日本人干得下三滥的事情了。能避免日货就应避免。这不是用户什么共产党,而是作为对小日的惩罚!!
mngb2010-02-16 11:32:13回复悄悄话佩服楼主,我要转载。我也不买日本车也在劝我的朋友不要买,但他们大多都不听。
wallingford19642010-02-16 11:31:45回复悄悄话又是一个帮老美抵毁日本车的家伙,无聊。
winbox2010-02-16 11:27:24回复悄悄话不管日本车美国车,顶哥们凡是较真的态度和绝不允许自己随大流的“反骨”精神。
踏雪追月2010-02-16 11:24:39回复悄悄话哈, 我开的就是SUBARU, 别说中国人, 连美国人大都没听说过这个牌子.
明月天山2010-02-16 11:24:29回复悄悄话非常谢谢阎先生的文章!